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	<title>Comments on: Yet More on Age-Ranging</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?feed=rss2&#038;p=313" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313</link>
	<description>The ramblings of a book-lover who created her dream job...</description>
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		<title>By: The Fidra Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Bookselling Conundrums</title>
		<link>http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-15875</link>
		<dc:creator>The Fidra Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Bookselling Conundrums</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2008 12:32:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313#comment-15875</guid>
		<description>[...] isn’t that difficult, and the font is large. Incidentally, this is another example of how age-ranging isn&#8217;t very practical, because this series would clearly stretch over more than one age [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] isn’t that difficult, and the font is large. Incidentally, this is another example of how age-ranging isn&#8217;t very practical, because this series would clearly stretch over more than one age [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Catriona</title>
		<link>http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-15397</link>
		<dc:creator>Catriona</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 Sep 2008 06:49:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313#comment-15397</guid>
		<description>Malcolm you must realise that children&#039;s literature is not a &#039;proper&#039; field for academic research and that the people who teach it are &#039;not really academics&#039;! 
Seriously I doubt that the situation in the UK is any different from the one here. I once had the enormous pleasure of attending a Children&#039;s Literature in Education conference at Exeter University in 1973 (okay my age is showing) and I can distinctly remember the same complaint being voiced back then.
We also have central buying here for the whole of the state of South Australia - and that is, all too often, market driven rather than quality driven. Local library is full of &#039;big social issues&#039;, second rate fantasy-adventure and Japanese style comic books...I exaggerate slightly but not much.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Malcolm you must realise that children&#8217;s literature is not a &#8216;proper&#8217; field for academic research and that the people who teach it are &#8216;not really academics&#8217;!<br />
Seriously I doubt that the situation in the UK is any different from the one here. I once had the enormous pleasure of attending a Children&#8217;s Literature in Education conference at Exeter University in 1973 (okay my age is showing) and I can distinctly remember the same complaint being voiced back then.<br />
We also have central buying here for the whole of the state of South Australia &#8211; and that is, all too often, market driven rather than quality driven. Local library is full of &#8216;big social issues&#8217;, second rate fantasy-adventure and Japanese style comic books&#8230;I exaggerate slightly but not much.</p>
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		<title>By: Julie Bertagna</title>
		<link>http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-15249</link>
		<dc:creator>Julie Bertagna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Sep 2008 11:40:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313#comment-15249</guid>
		<description>Thanks, Roger and Malcolm. A lot to ponder and digest here...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Roger and Malcolm. A lot to ponder and digest here&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Malcolm</title>
		<link>http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-15241</link>
		<dc:creator>Malcolm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Sep 2008 10:47:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313#comment-15241</guid>
		<description>Back to the &lt;i&gt;Expanding the Book Market&lt;/i&gt; report.  According to this report the average number of books bought, per annum, by adults is 8.

The Publishers Association state that the number of books sold in the UK for 2006 (sorry I couldn&#039;t find the figures for 2005) was 787 million, and National Statistics (census 2001) gives the adult population of the UK at about 45.5 million.  This gives a total of just over 17 books bought, per annum, by adults.

That&#039;s quite a large discrepancy, so I&#039;ll leave you to draw your own conclusions about the validity of the &lt;i&gt;Expanding the Book Market&lt;/i&gt; sampling methods and data.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Back to the <i>Expanding the Book Market</i> report.  According to this report the average number of books bought, per annum, by adults is 8.</p>
<p>The Publishers Association state that the number of books sold in the UK for 2006 (sorry I couldn&#8217;t find the figures for 2005) was 787 million, and National Statistics (census 2001) gives the adult population of the UK at about 45.5 million.  This gives a total of just over 17 books bought, per annum, by adults.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s quite a large discrepancy, so I&#8217;ll leave you to draw your own conclusions about the validity of the <i>Expanding the Book Market</i> sampling methods and data.</p>
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		<title>By: Malcolm</title>
		<link>http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-15236</link>
		<dc:creator>Malcolm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Sep 2008 09:38:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313#comment-15236</guid>
		<description>Roger, thanks for requesting that information and posting the links.  I&#039;m sure it&#039;ll keep myself and others busy digesting it all.  I&#039;ve had a quick look through some of the forms and one paragraph in the proposal struck me...

&lt;i&gt;The Publishers Association Children&#039;s Book Group is asking for &#039;Grants for the Arts&#039; funding of £5k to assist with Phase 2 of a project to introduce a nationwide scheme to classify children&#039;s books by recommended reading age and content.&lt;/i&gt;

It&#039;s nice to see the PA maintained an independent and unbiased view about this important issue before they applied for this funding - they even seem to know the results of phase 1 before it was even started.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Roger, thanks for requesting that information and posting the links.  I&#8217;m sure it&#8217;ll keep myself and others busy digesting it all.  I&#8217;ve had a quick look through some of the forms and one paragraph in the proposal struck me&#8230;</p>
<p><i>The Publishers Association Children&#8217;s Book Group is asking for &#8216;Grants for the Arts&#8217; funding of £5k to assist with Phase 2 of a project to introduce a nationwide scheme to classify children&#8217;s books by recommended reading age and content.</i></p>
<p>It&#8217;s nice to see the PA maintained an independent and unbiased view about this important issue before they applied for this funding &#8211; they even seem to know the results of phase 1 before it was even started.</p>
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		<title>By: Roger Cornwell</title>
		<link>http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-15176</link>
		<dc:creator>Roger Cornwell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 17:35:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313#comment-15176</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m the webmaster for &#039;No to Age Banding&#039; and some time back, having learned of the Arts Council funding, I made a Freedom of Information request to Arts Council England. A large packet of papers came through the post which I subsequently scanned and have placed online, here&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.notoagebanding.org/?foi/index&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;a list of what we have&lt;/a&gt;.

The Publishers&#039; Association have also put together an &#039;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.publishers.org.uk/en/childrens/age_guidance/age-guidance-document-library.cfm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Age Guidance Document Library&lt;/a&gt;&#039; you might want to refer to. The Acacia Avenue Data is particularly illuminating and this informed the Newsletter that was circulated about the research.

The budget was £35.5k of which the Arts Council provided £5k.

Having read the administrative stuff in that submission, it struck me how uncritical the Arts Council in London were. You might have thought these things are looked at with a degree of healthy scepticism, well ... think again. On the credit side, however, is Mark Robinson, head of the North East part of the Arts Council, who &lt;a href=&quot;http://artscounselling.blogspot.com/2008/06/am-i-now-too-old-to-enjoy-on-road.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;blogged about this topic&lt;/a&gt;.

And I hope those links all come out, or I may have to start again ...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m the webmaster for &#8216;No to Age Banding&#8217; and some time back, having learned of the Arts Council funding, I made a Freedom of Information request to Arts Council England. A large packet of papers came through the post which I subsequently scanned and have placed online, here&#8217;s <a href="http://www.notoagebanding.org/?foi/index" rel="nofollow">a list of what we have</a>.</p>
<p>The Publishers&#8217; Association have also put together an &#8216;<a href="http://www.publishers.org.uk/en/childrens/age_guidance/age-guidance-document-library.cfm" rel="nofollow">Age Guidance Document Library</a>&#8216; you might want to refer to. The Acacia Avenue Data is particularly illuminating and this informed the Newsletter that was circulated about the research.</p>
<p>The budget was £35.5k of which the Arts Council provided £5k.</p>
<p>Having read the administrative stuff in that submission, it struck me how uncritical the Arts Council in London were. You might have thought these things are looked at with a degree of healthy scepticism, well &#8230; think again. On the credit side, however, is Mark Robinson, head of the North East part of the Arts Council, who <a href="http://artscounselling.blogspot.com/2008/06/am-i-now-too-old-to-enjoy-on-road.html" rel="nofollow">blogged about this topic</a>.</p>
<p>And I hope those links all come out, or I may have to start again &#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Julie Bertagna</title>
		<link>http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-15164</link>
		<dc:creator>Julie Bertagna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 13:43:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313#comment-15164</guid>
		<description>Thanks, Malcolm. It gets murkier and murkier the deeper you dig.

As an ex-primary teacher, as well as an author, experience tells me there are a lot of very useful ways to give &#039;clearer guidance on the suitability of a book for a child&#039;s (reading!!) age&#039;, but branding an actual age category on the book is by far the least helpful and least accurate way of all.

But providing guidance that would truly help adults and children would take time and skill and expertise from publishers. 

So, hey, let&#039;s just fling together a cover and blurb with hours to spare before a production deadline...!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Malcolm. It gets murkier and murkier the deeper you dig.</p>
<p>As an ex-primary teacher, as well as an author, experience tells me there are a lot of very useful ways to give &#8216;clearer guidance on the suitability of a book for a child&#8217;s (reading!!) age&#8217;, but branding an actual age category on the book is by far the least helpful and least accurate way of all.</p>
<p>But providing guidance that would truly help adults and children would take time and skill and expertise from publishers. </p>
<p>So, hey, let&#8217;s just fling together a cover and blurb with hours to spare before a production deadline&#8230;!</p>
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		<title>By: Malcolm</title>
		<link>http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-15163</link>
		<dc:creator>Malcolm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 13:12:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313#comment-15163</guid>
		<description>Julie, I’ve run a search on the whole document and there is in fact only one mention of age-guidance.  Searching for “guidance”, a paragraph at the bottom of section 2.7.2 (page 21) says…

&lt;em&gt;There was also solid support for a number of other initiatives such as the ability to find out about authors similar to other writers, clearer guidance on the suitability of a book for a child’s age and more best-seller lists within book genres.&lt;/em&gt;

However, at no point do they quantify the level of support, indicate whether age-guidance was part of the questionnaire or if it came up in a comments section at the end.  It is also ambiguous if they mean clearer categories within bookshops, or age-guidance printed on books.  The other initiatives are all associated with bookshops, so it doesn’t seem unreasonable to link &lt;em&gt;clearer guidance&lt;/em&gt; with shelf categories and advice points within the bookshop.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Julie, I’ve run a search on the whole document and there is in fact only one mention of age-guidance.  Searching for “guidance”, a paragraph at the bottom of section 2.7.2 (page 21) says…</p>
<p><em>There was also solid support for a number of other initiatives such as the ability to find out about authors similar to other writers, clearer guidance on the suitability of a book for a child’s age and more best-seller lists within book genres.</em></p>
<p>However, at no point do they quantify the level of support, indicate whether age-guidance was part of the questionnaire or if it came up in a comments section at the end.  It is also ambiguous if they mean clearer categories within bookshops, or age-guidance printed on books.  The other initiatives are all associated with bookshops, so it doesn’t seem unreasonable to link <em>clearer guidance</em> with shelf categories and advice points within the bookshop.</p>
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		<title>By: Julie Bertagna</title>
		<link>http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-15160</link>
		<dc:creator>Julie Bertagna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 10:10:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313#comment-15160</guid>
		<description>And yet this is what the PA say on their website regarding this supposed  &#039;demand&#039; for age-guidance:

&quot;The issue of age-guidance on children’s books came to the fore in 2005 with the publication of the Expanding the Book Market report1, commissioned from the research company Book Marketing Limited (BML) by Arts Council England (ACE) and other funding partners. The report made various recommendations for improved information for readers and book buyers, including the provision of age-guidance on children’s books to encourage gift-buying.&quot;

I must have blinked and missed the bit where the report recommends this...   did you find it, Malcolm?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And yet this is what the PA say on their website regarding this supposed  &#8216;demand&#8217; for age-guidance:</p>
<p>&#8220;The issue of age-guidance on children’s books came to the fore in 2005 with the publication of the Expanding the Book Market report1, commissioned from the research company Book Marketing Limited (BML) by Arts Council England (ACE) and other funding partners. The report made various recommendations for improved information for readers and book buyers, including the provision of age-guidance on children’s books to encourage gift-buying.&#8221;</p>
<p>I must have blinked and missed the bit where the report recommends this&#8230;   did you find it, Malcolm?</p>
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		<title>By: Malcolm</title>
		<link>http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-15158</link>
		<dc:creator>Malcolm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 09:01:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fidrabooks.co.uk/blog/?p=313#comment-15158</guid>
		<description>As someone who has had over 15 years of experience in university research departments, I still find it unbelievable that public money should go to carry out market research.  The last time I looked we still had some excellent universities.  As Vanessa mentioned, if they had funded a multidisciplinary research project including experts in retail business and child literacy and development, submitted their research for peer review and published their work in respected journals, then their findings might actually be credible.  As it stands this report is nothing more than joke.

One bit of the report that I particularly liked was that of all the people asked only 1% found it difficult to choose for children*.

*14 non-buyers don’t know what to get/how to choose for children (Table 2.4.3) and 14 light or medium buyers found it difficult to choose for children (Table 2.5.4), which gives 28 people of the original 2000 sample.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As someone who has had over 15 years of experience in university research departments, I still find it unbelievable that public money should go to carry out market research.  The last time I looked we still had some excellent universities.  As Vanessa mentioned, if they had funded a multidisciplinary research project including experts in retail business and child literacy and development, submitted their research for peer review and published their work in respected journals, then their findings might actually be credible.  As it stands this report is nothing more than joke.</p>
<p>One bit of the report that I particularly liked was that of all the people asked only 1% found it difficult to choose for children*.</p>
<p>*14 non-buyers don’t know what to get/how to choose for children (Table 2.4.3) and 14 light or medium buyers found it difficult to choose for children (Table 2.5.4), which gives 28 people of the original 2000 sample.</p>
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